Surprise surprise, drama in /r/tinder (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
71 ups - 0 downs = 71 votes
301 comments submitted at 21:48:44 on Aug 18, 2014 by turnups
Surprise surprise, drama in /r/tinder (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
71 ups - 0 downs = 71 votes
301 comments submitted at 21:48:44 on Aug 18, 2014 by turnups
>I'm not attracted to black women either. No matter how thin or pretty.
. . . sorry, how is this not racist? "No matter how attractive they are, their race is just a dealbreaker".
Couldn't that just be considered a preference? Yes it is arguably racist, but it's no worse than saying that you aren't attracted to Asians or any other subset.
I'd say those are all racist. As are people specifically into black men cuckolding white men by fucking their white wives with their "big black cocks", as are people specifically into Asians because of their fantasies about submissive Asian women, as are people who fetishize Latino folks as hypersexual "Latin lovers", as are people who claim Asian men are categorically unattractive . . .
If your sexual preferences are based on racist cultural baggage, those sexual preferences are racist.
And really, things like that aren't immutable. They can be changed with some effort, and they should be. At the very least people should be self-aware enough not to broadcast that shit and claim it isn't racist.
I really don't see why it's racist. People have preferences and saying that people should have to be attracted to certain things, or that they should make an effort to adjust their preferences, is really creepy.
"I am not attracted to black women"
"why?"
"I think they are unattractive"
"why?"
"Their facial features and skin"
"Why?"
"I dunno it's just a preference"
"why?"
"Cause I was born like this"
>"I dunno it's just a preference"
>"why?"
This would be where the conversation starts looping between these two responses.
> As are people specifically into black men cuckolding white men by fucking their white wives with their "big black cocks", as are people specifically into Asians because of their fantasies about submissive Asian women, as are people who fetishize Latino folks as hypersexual "Latin lovers", as are people who claim Asian men are categorically unattractive . . .
whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa
Lets not delve into your porn fantasies ok?
Which is also racist. Why would you immediately write off a whole race of women?
Edit: Racism isnt an all or nothing game people. You can have racist tendencies/feelings and not be 100% kkk member. We all have racist thoughts and feelings but we are just human.
Because you aren't attracted to them?
Because of their race? You are saying right now out of the millions of [insert race here] type women out there there is not a single one that you are attracted too? Man I wish I had that level of certainty about anything in my life let alone what I am sexually attracted to.
I'm glad that you seem have a much better grasp over my sexual preferences than I do. I'm not saying anything, if I find someone attractive they are attractive regardless of their skin color. That said, I don't think there is anything wrong with having a preference, it's human nature.
I'm not talking personally to you I'm addressing the logic. I'm sure you love Asian women.
Yes, it is closed minded of them to discount an group of people based on a single factor, but it's still no worse than any other sexual preference. Some people just aren't attracted to certain things, and that includes certain skin colors.
But that is bollocks. Everyone has preference. I can say I prefer Latina women. That does not mean I will proudly say I can not be attracted to other women. That means if I had to choose, I would pick a hot latina as my first choice. My preference is not a goddamn orientation where my brain is wired like that. It is a bullshit excuse.
Same as people saying they are not into short guys or whatever. I bet if you gave those girls some pretty boy like Zack Efron who is 5'6 they would cream their panties. But given the preference, they would actively seek tall guys.
When Redditors proudly claim "I'm not attracted to black women" and then cry when people point out that such a proclamation, like it or not, is rooted in passive deep rooted racism, I just laugh because it is true and the only reason people are bitching in this thread is because they can't be arsed to admit to themselves a hard truth about who the fuck they are.
TBF, there are definitely girls out there who aren't attracted to short guys, even if they look like Zack Efron
In other words, some people are just racist, but we're not comfortable using that label because they're a slave to their racist sexual urges.
Meh. I think its worse than other sexual preferences.
> I'm glad that you seem have a much better grasp over my sexual preferences than I do.
The idea that you're attributing your dislike of an entire race to some innate preference is kind of the problem.
He didn't say anything about disliking any race. He said that some people are not particularly attracted to others because of race. You can like and respect people regardless of whether or not they're your type.
It's a figure of speech. I might say 'I'm not attracted to blondes'. That doesn't mean there isn't a blonde out there somewhere that I might want to bang.
Except when people say "I'm not attracted to blondes" they generally mean something like "I prefer brunettes/redheads". I've never heard someone say "I'm not attracted to blonde women either. No matter how thin or pretty."
I'm not attracted to blondes, no matter how thin and pretty they are. All the women in my family are super blonde, so I've always associated blonde hair with family. Twist my arm, I'd probably still have sex with a pretgy blonde girl, but I would really struggle to date her.
We all have preferences. In the case of black womem, it isn't racist as long as the reason you're not attracted to black women has nothing to do with their race. In other words, my lack of attraction to them has nothing to do with their ancestry, race, or culture. I'm just not attracted to the average black women's facial features, just like I'm not attracted to the average chinese women's facial features.
That makes more sense. But still being blond is something that a girl can change and then you suddenly like them I guess, but an Asian girl could never pretend to be White. It doesn't feel like they are comparable to me.
Right, but whether or not they can or cannot change an aspect about themselves makes no difference. It's still not racist to have a preference. What about guys who don't like short women? They can't change that. Well, apart from heels.
I can attest to this. I'd never date a guy who was shorter than me, even if by 3 or four inches. So I'm not going to cry racism if someone doesn't want to date me because of my race when I would date someone because of their height.
[deleted]
We're talking about finding people attractive. Not how they're treated. Unless you are saying we should date people we don't find attractive just so they aren't left out?
^^I'm ^^copying ^^and ^^pasting ^^what ^^I ^^said ^^earlier:
Not finding someone attractive doesn't mean you think lesser of them. I can agree that it'd prejudiced, but not racist.
Prejudiced based on? Height? Race? So prejudice based on the race of someone is now all of a sudden "preference" because it hurts feelings yeah?
1. Yes, it's my preference. I prefer men who are taller than me. Let's say I meet a 79 year old man whose personality i like and we hit it off. Would I be ageist if I refused to date him? How about if I said I prefer men my age?
2. Hurts whose feelings? Is there someone sobbing behind their keyboard because some guy they'll never meet wouldn't date them?
> 1. Yes, it's my preference. I prefer men who are taller than me. Let's say I meet a 79 year old man whose personality i like and we hit it off. Would I be ageist if I refused to date him? How about if I said I prefer men my age? > 2. Hurts whose feelings? Is there someone sobbing behind their keyboard because some guy they'll never meet wouldn't date them?
You're using false eqivalences to hell. There is a reason you are not attracted to children. They are pre-pubescent and young and not sexually desirable. There is also a reason you are not physically attracted to old people although that is still not set in stone as there are many people who are. There is also a reason you are not attracted to short guys and it has fuck all to do with biology but it is simply your superficial perception of short guys. That is a fact. Just because your "preference" is racist does not mean you are burning crosses. It means you have a racial bias same as your height bias.
Listen, we're going to go back and forth on this. Neither of our opinions will change and in the end we'd have both wasted our time. I do want to ask you though: what do you think should be done? Because let me tell you, no one is going to stop doing it. You can stew over it or take a bullhorn and yell through the streets, but no one is going to stop letting race/height/ethnicity dictate who they date. You're wasting your time.
Wait, so is being racist not being prejudiced then? When was this decided, the last klan rally?
Some people don't like various features. Some people aren't into read heads - is it bad that they aren't particularly attractive to them? No, of course not. Sometimes people just are (or aren't) into certain characteristics. As long as you don't go around treating people like shit because they do or don't have certain traits then it's pretty resonable.
If we could choose what and who we were attracted to the world would be very different.
To say that is to assume you know what every black woman is like, when in fact they come in all shades and with all different features. It is racist as hell to go "But they're black, so i'm not interested." Sorry your feelings are so hurt when people call you out on your racism.
It's not fucking racist, jesus. Are you crazy?
No. Apparently you are though.
> Why would you immediately write off a whole race of women?
Many of the older women in my family aren't attracted to white men, are they racist?
Do they say "no white man will ever be attractive to me" then yes.
LOL you're funny.
So if I say no fat person will be attractive to me what does that mean?
How is that racist? He's not commenting on their character or worth as a human being, he's saying he's not attracted to them. It's like women saying they're not attracted to short men or guys saying they're not attracted to flat-chested women.
At most, it's superficial. It's not racist.
"pretty" is subjective. It's not unreasonable to say that you don't find many black people pretty due to some common combination of facial features or whatever, but if you see a black person who you find physically attractive and are still not interested without knowing anything else about that person... that's racism.
That's an interesting argument, but I have to disagree. Letting one physical characteristic be a deal breaker is not unheard of by any means. Women not going for short men is a good example. It's not exactly uncommon for a woman to reject a short guy purely on that basis, even if he's good looking. In this case, the physical characteristic that's a deal breaker is skin color. Just because skin color is correlated with racism doesn't mean that any issue dealing with skin color = racism.
height isn't related to race. Skin color... is.
You're missing the point. I'm saying that height is no different from race in this context, because it's simply another physical characteristic that constitutes attractiveness. Just because 'racist' exists as a word doesn't mean we should be using it in every situation that race pops up.
> Just because 'racist' exists as a word doesn't mean we should be using it in every situation that race pops up.
No, just every time someone is discriminating against other people due to their race, because that's the definition of the word.
Not being willing to date someone is not discriminating against them.
What do you think discriminating means?
Courtesy of marriam-webster.com.
"the practice of unfairly treating a person or group of people differently from other people or groups of people"
The keyword here is 'unfairly'.
Not dating someone even though they are 99.999999999999% perfect for you just because they're black is.
It's still not. No one's owed a date with anyone. I can reject who I want, when I want. You can say I'm a jackass for doing so, you can say my reasons are petty, but don't you suggest that the mere act of rejecting someone I don't want to date for any reason is wrong.
Not quite. The definition of 'racism' is far more broad than simply discrimination. To quote the googled definition of 'racism': "the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races."
There's discrimination AND prejudice involved. It's not simply discrimination.
Oh, prejudice like, for example, refusing to date a person due to their skin color?
You can enjoy as much mental gymnastics as you want. It's racism. Fortunately for you, most of reddit likes racists.
I see you've simply resorted to a childish 'I don't care what you say, I'm still right!', which means you're clearly not interested in discussion. Good day.
How is racism not based on superficial characteristics?
When did I say racism is not based on superficial characteristics?
Compare the following statements: "Black girls aren't my type." and "There must be something wrong with black people, they commit more crimes than other racial groups."
You really think that the statement which judges people's character and worth based on the color of their skin is even close to the same thing as expressing a preference (or an anti-preference, in this case)?
But why are black girls not your type? Is it that you don't find them attractive? Is it that you believe them all to be obnoxious? That's where the racism lies.
>Is it that you don't find them attractive
Is there a problem with this reason?
Well, it's complicated. Saying that you don't find them attractive because "It's just biology man" is a stupid cop out answer and untrue to say the least. Your beauty standards are greatly influenced by the cultural standards that you grew up in. The problem is that most people either deny or just simply ignore this factor.
Just to be clear, I'm not denying that cultural standards play a big role in what people consider attractive. What I do deny, is the idea that prettiness is the only thing that matters in attraction, that people can't have deal breakers that relate to physical features, including race.
Like I've said in all my other posts, I don't see it as being any different from women rejecting short guys purely on the basis of height, even if those guys are really good looking. Or guys who just don't find waifish, thin girls attractive even if facially they might be really pretty. At least, that's the case for me; if a girl is extremely, extremely thin, it's going to be a turnoff for me even if she has a pretty face. What would you call me then, since race is not involved? I can't think of a term other than superficial, and I don't see why we need to tack on the additional damaging accusation of racism against someone who doesn't find black skin attractive.
>What I do deny, is the idea that prettiness is the only thing that matters in attraction, that people can't have deal breakers that relate to physical features, including race.
Then we are closer than I thought. I'm not going to deny preferences. What irks me is when these preferences come up and the people with them shut their ears when presented with the fact that, no, it is not biology that has given you said preference. Also, having a preference and being racist aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.
>I don't see why we need to tack on the additional damaging accusation of racism against someone who doesn't find black skin attractive.
The problem I usually see is that saying "I just don't find any black women attractive" is such a huge blanket that yes, I would say you're racist. A women could literally be perfect in every way, but her skin color means a no? That's pretty racist. You can have a preference and still be racist.
>Also, having a preference and being racist aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.
Agreed, but having a racial preference and being racist isn't necessarily inclusive either.
>A women could literally be perfect in every way, but her skin color means a no? That's pretty racist. You can have a preference and still be racist.
I don't think that's inherently racist. I consider that to be just like other deal breaking physical characteristics, the nature of which varies from person to person. My issue is that I'm concerned about the use of the word 'racist' when the meaning of racism is far broader and deeper than simply preference for physical features.
Okay... But black women come in every size, with different kinds of hair, in any shade from light caramel to deep black. Even different eye colours. There's no one common trait among them besides "being black" and if thats a dealbreaker you are racist.
I think you meant to say "problematic" instead of "complicated."
Personal preference for dating isn't necessarily racist. Whether you prefer blondes or whites or short people or fat people... that's your choice. That doesn't mean you think of them as lesser people; it simply means that you, as a person, have your own preferences for what you are sexually attracted to. Race is just one of many characteristics that come into it; it's not special in some way. You're not obligated to feel attracted to everyone.
Edit: also, it's not the same as finding somebody attractive or pretty or anything -- I'm just talking about dating preferences.
Prejudice is based on superficial external qualities.
Racism is based on deeper internal qualities.
I know people who say they prefer X trait, like height or big breasts. I don't know anyone who says "I am not attracted to women with small breasts no matter how pretty they are".
I think it's both superficial and racist.
What about women who say they aren't attracted to short guys despite how good looking they are? Have you encountered women like that? I certainly have, both from meeting and knowing tall women and short guys.
I said it in another below, but just because racism involves skin color doesn't mean that every issue involving skin color is racist. Prettiness is only one component of attraction, it's not the only thing that people like. Some people have specific deal breakers, and sometimes it can be skin color, just like any other physical characteristic.
Is it possible that someone who isn't attracted to black people is racist? Of course. Does it NECESSARILY mean that he's racist? Of course not.
I have not encountered women like that, no, but I'll believe you that they exist. And you know what, I think that's not really cool, either. That's tied up in bullshit stereotypes about what it means to be a man.
I think that someone who isn't racist just wouldn't say "I don't think black people are attractive, no matter how pretty". Someone who isn't racist wouldn't discount an entire race of people. Someone who isn't racist would say something more like "I prefer pale(/tan/olive/whatever) skin" and be open to at least the possibility that there likely does exist a black person they'd get along with very well and be attracted to.
I'm pretty sure most of us have certain physical preferences in sexual partners, but those are usually not hard rules. Turning one into a hard rule is weird at best, and turning a preference about skin tone into a hard rule about race is just racist.
>I have not encountered women like that, no, but I'll believe you that they exist. And you know what, I think that's not really cool, either. That's tied up in bullshit stereotypes about what it means to be a man.
Fully agreed. I think it's superficial as all heck.
>I think that someone who isn't racist just wouldn't say "I don't think black people are attractive, no matter how pretty". Someone who isn't racist wouldn't discount an entire race of people. Someone who isn't racist would say something more like "I prefer pale(/tan/olive/whatever) skin" and be open to at least the possibility that there likely does exist a black person they'd get along with very well and be attracted to. I'm pretty sure most of us have certain physical preferences in sexual partners, but those are usually not hard rules. Turning one into a hard rule is weird at best, and turning a preference about skin tone into a hard rule about race is just racist.
I agree that phrasing it as a hard rule is weird, but really, consider the context of the original post. It's Tinder, people are going to be hardasses about their preferences; from what I've seen on other dating sites, it's much the same. The nature of these dating sites and apps makes people extremely biased against features they don't care for. Why would I say 'I prefer 'A or B or C and mayyyyybe D' when I can simply say 'No D'?
Again, I don't see why we need to tack on an additional label of 'racist' just because it involves race. To me, a deal breaker that involves race is no different than a deal breaker that involves literally any other physical characteristic. Racism carries so much more meaning than simply preference, and I find it a case of diluting the term if we start applying it to situations where it doesn't really belong.
I suppose we will have to agree to disagree though. Thanks for the discussion!
So it's superficial to not date a guy because he's short, but not to not date a girl because she's black?
Superficial both ways, IMO. I've never said it wasn't superficial.
Many people say exactly that about short guys...
I knew a white chick who wasn't attracted to white guys. Racist?
I'm not attracted to black men. I definitely wouldn't consider myself racist, and yes, I've had a crush on a black guy before. I just wasn't physically attracted to him; it was his personality that I liked. However, I swipe left on 99% of black Tinder guys.
Tinder is a hookup app. This guy is not racist for not wanting to hook up with black chicks. I am not racist for not being physically attracted to black men any more than I'm racist for being physically attracted to Latinos.
(Edit: I have, on rare occasion, been attracted to black men. In my experience, when people say they aren't attracted to black guys or whatever, they're talking about the vast majority, but there are almost always exceptions.)
(Second edit: I have a dark-skinned friend who's almost exclusively attracted to caramel guys. Racist?)
>In my experience, when people say they aren't attracted to black guys or whatever, they're talking about the vast majority, but there are almost always exceptions.
The quote I'm talking about is no exceptions, though. They find black women categorically unappealing no matter how pretty they are.
Here what I just replied to someone else:
I think that someone who isn't racist just wouldn't say "I don't think black people are attractive, no matter how pretty". Someone who isn't racist wouldn't discount an entire race of people. Someone who isn't racist would say something more like "I prefer pale(/tan/olive/whatever) skin" and be open to at least the possibility that there likely does exist a black person they'd get along with very well and be attracted to.
I'm pretty sure most of us have certain physical preferences in sexual partners, but those are usually not hard rules. Turning one into a hard rule is weird at best, and turning a preference about skin tone into a hard rule about race is just racist.
Not finding someone attractive doesn't mean you think lesser of them. I can agree that it'd prejudiced, but not racist.
racism is literally prejudice based on race.
And what I'm saying is: it's not prejudice, it's preference.
And what I'm saying is: it's not prejudice, it's preference.
My god, you are upset about who other people don't want to fuck. Who fucking cares? If they start fucking black woman, would that make you happy?
You're the only one upset here.
SubredditDramaDrama disagrees.
This isn't even posted there. The fuck are you talking about?
Give some patience. They ain't gonna miss out on a shitfeast this big.
Ah yes, the age old tactic of, "I know you are, but what am I." Clever.
But seriously, why are you so upset these guys don't want to fuck black women? What negative effect does them not having sex with those women have? I simply don't understand the outrage.
I'm not upset. I'm simply pointing out that it is, indeed, a preference based on racism.
No, it is simply a preference based on race. Do you think people who have a preference for a certain hair color are "colorists" against the other hair colors?
Except those people say "I prefer blondes" not "I don't date red heads"
People say 'I'm not into blondes' or 'id never date a short guy' all the time.
You do seem pretty upset dude.
U mad bro?
You are the one yelling like a child who spilled his 100% racially pure milk.
Yes. She is a racist.
> . . . sorry, how is this not racist?
How is it racist? It's the same as not preferring a certain hair color. (In this case and this case only). You can't really pick and choose what you're attracted too.
I don't know anyone who's ever been like "I am not attracted to blonde women no matter how pretty they are. Blonde hair is just a dealbreaker".
And actually, yeah, you can self-evaluate about your preferences in sexual partners. A lot of that stuff is very environmental and cultural, it's not immutable.
My point was he didn't like a physical characteristic. He's not saying 'I dislike black people'. He's just not attracted to a physical characteristic. The meme may have been a bit harsh but it's not racist.
Which physical characteristic is he against? Is it just skin tone? Because there are dozens of different shades of black people. So which one is it? Does he not like girls eith big lips? Or nappy hair? What is the defining physicaly charscteristic that all black people share that he is so opposed to?
Maybe it's not one physical trait, it could be a combination of them. But by definition it's not racist.
Which combination of physical traits are inherent in all black people? It is racist because you are assuming that because a person is black they automatically have whatever physical traits you stereotype them with. Racism is not just lynching and voting rights.
> Which combination of physical traits are inherent in all black people? It is racist because you are assuming that because a person is black they automatically have whatever physical traits you stereotype them with.
What? All black people share similar physical traits, they vary a lot but they're similar. This is not racist. Caucasians have similar features, Asians have similar features, etc. It's not racism to say so.
Which traits do they share? Im asking you. No one in this thread has mentioned which traits all black people have besides the fact they have slightly darker skin then yours. Caucasian people are totally vsried are you kidding me? Compare an irishman to an eastern european. Compare an indian with a korean. Oh my god yes they are all different. Just like black people.
Facial structure, hair, skin color, etc. I'm not saying everyone of the same race is the same, I'm saying they have similar traits.
What physical characteristic? Black people can have quite a range of skin tones. He isn't saying he has a preference for a certain skin tone, in my reading. He's saying he discounts a certain category of people.
Black women don't all look the same
I didn't say that though. I said people of a race (any race mind you) share similar features.
Not really. Someone descended from Somalis and someone descended from Ghanans would be considered the same race in North America yet have no similar features at all. Africa is the most genetically diverse continent on the planet, yet their American descendants are thrown into one category and dismissed as unattractive.
No. That is not at all the case.
I know a guy who won't sleep with a brunette. Full stop. Is he racist against brunettes?
No... but he's really weird.
"You're right, but I still feel the need to be insulting."
Don't you suppose he means regardless of whether they are pretty by conventional standards? He obviously doesn't feel they are, or he would be attracted to them.
Is their entire race = to their skin color?
Would that make having 'a type' discrimination? Not everyone is attracted to everything. It would be racism if they harboured any ill will towards people because of their race or thought that they should be discriminated aginst. But not being attracted to someone doesn't really cut it. There's no unfair treatment or anything. Attraction is based on appearance and race can influence appearence and by extent attraction.
It can hurt to be told that some people are attracted to you, but that's not a race issue. It works with anything aesthetic: height, weight, hair colour, length and style, body shape, etc.