/r/TwoXChromosomes/ drama: Men roofie drinks, all men should be ashamed of themselves (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
62 ups - 0 downs = 62 votes
204 comments submitted at 16:05:26 on Jul 26, 2014 by loosedata
/r/TwoXChromosomes/ drama: Men roofie drinks, all men should be ashamed of themselves (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
62 ups - 0 downs = 62 votes
204 comments submitted at 16:05:26 on Jul 26, 2014 by loosedata
ALL SEX IS RAPE SHITLORD
I've yet to meet anyone in real life who genuinely believes this. Some of those comments are pretty squirrely, IMO.
BUT ANDREA DWORKIN EXISTED ONCE YOU FEMINAZI.
Edit: Should I have included a /s tag on this? Is this why the downvotes?
Downvotes because, even sarcastically, it's dumb.
Howso? I've gotten into several arguments with people on Reddit about this sentiment and every time they use Andrea Dworkin as an excuse to pin this ideology on feminists in general. The fact of the matter is she was considered way radical even amongst feminists of the time and the vast majority of feminists do not agree with her.
The "feminazis" I always see cited are Dworkin and Valerie Solanas. Anti-feminists usually can't think of anyone but a couple of dead second-wavers (not to mention that they refer to things that Dworkin didn't even say, but I digress...).
The Vagina Monologues, which is a play being performed everywhere on university campuses, has a 16 year old child being raped by a lesbian and its portrayed as a positive experience and a good thing. Academic feminism is very closely aligned with lesbian separatist feminism.
Who are the thought leaders of the movement? Can we come up with a better example of Dworkins? No we cant.
European academic feminism is more moderate than American feminism, but does not represent the mainstream of the international movement. European feminists are on record as accusing of "American Man Hating Lesbians" of hijacking the international feminist movement.
In fact, many of the previous leaders of the "feminist" movement who were kicked out by the lesbian separatists are denouncing the movement and advocating for "Mens Rights", such as the former president of NOW (the largest and most influential feminist NGO in US).
Then there are dissenters and feminists proper like Paglia, but who are exiled from the movement because they do not hate men. There was a massive scuffle within NOW during the late 80s (the largest feminists organization in US) and the moderate feminists were kicked out. They even put quotas on number of women in NOW who could be married (women who were sleeping with the enemy). Since then the implicit lesbian separatist agenda has increased within the NGO organizations representing the feminist movement.
San Francisco has a heavy concentration of Marx Feminists and they believe that "women are oppressed and men are the oppressors". It is not too far from Dworkin's position.
Yeah, can you provide a source for that claim that NOW limits the number of women who can be married? I can't find anything on that.
Update: Found it!
Most of this material is in Books. It happened in 70s and 80s and predates internet.
During the late 70s or 80s there was a leadership transition and divide between liberal feminists in the movement and more radical factions. They had some scheme that limited the number of delegates for leadership elections based on whether the women was married. Many of the less radical people were eventually pushed out.
I'm calling bullshit. You seem like you have an agenda and you aren't providing any proof. I can find nothing that says anywhere that this ever happened. Provide proof or shut up.
The only agenda is truth.
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>such as the former president of NOW (the largest and most influential feminist NGO in US).
Are you referring to Warren Farrell? Because you got that wrong, he wasn't the president of NOW. Just a local branch leader in NYC.
You really don't have to exaggerate these people. People like him and Christina Hoff Sommers were not hugely influential people.
Warran Farrell and Christina Hoff Sommers, they are good examples but not the top level leadership. Christina Hoff Sommers is important, because of her writing on the internals of the movement, its history and relationship between the academics and activist organizations.
When Andrea Yates killed her children, NOW lobbied and protested to have her acquitted and paid for her legal defense on appeal. They have introduced bills giving Post Paratum Depression, legal status that would allow women to kill their children with minimum or no criminal liability.
Publicly, they are very moderate. However, look at what they are lobbying for.
Is that what the Vagina Monologues is about? I was really confused when the girls on campus were yelling about it.
It is absolutely not what the vagina monologues is about. I was in the vagina monologues in college and I have no idea about the monologue he's referring to. The one I performed was about a woman in the Congo who had reconstructive surgery after being gang raped during war. Others were about women who had gotten to advanced ages without ever having an orgasm, or about women who celebrated the pleasure of orgasm through moaning. It's just a collection of stories about the experience of having a vagina, and it also changes every year.
EDIT: also, hate to be that person, but this guy is a RedPill poster so let's not believe what he has to say about feminism unquestioningky, hmmmm?
The monologue he is referring to definitely exists and it is definitely fucking horrible.
> I was in the vagina monologues in college and I have no idea about the monologue he's referring to.
It's called "The Little Coochie Snorcher That Could": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TheVaginaMonologues#Criticism
I watched the vagina monologues last year and I remember the monologue in question. However, where I live the AoC is sixteen and wouldn't be rape, though it would be creepy.
In the original version she was 13, they modified it to 16 in new versions in response to criticism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TheVaginaMonologues#Criticism
Lets look at what wikipedia says
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TheVaginaMonologues#Criticism
Do we get a Penis Monologue?
Sure, if you'd like to write that play I think it would be really cool.
Yes and no. It is a series of skits written by women about some aspect of their sexuality, usually tying in with their vagina. One of the monologues is about a sixteen year old girl who has sex with a much older woman. Depending on where the skit is preformed and the age of consent in that location, it might be rape.
What makes it worse is that in the original play, the girl was 13 and there was a line: "if it was rape, it was a good rape" which is pretty fucked up.
holy shit. wooow, that's insanity.
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Its not the main theme. However, it is revealing that there is a rape and its portrayed as positive because a women/lesbian was the rapist and not a man.
People have preconceptions about what feminism is and what its agenda is. Ignore them. Go read a book by a feminists thought leader. Most people who say they are feminists, do not understand what feminism is.
There is
Then then there are pop-feminists and they dont have a cohesive world view, they are sort of like a political party or mob with a particular opinion and dont have to be coherent (like SRS). Its like cheering for a football team. These people have never read a book by the thought leaders.
> lesbian seperatism (mainstream pop-feminism)
Hahahahaha are you fucking serious dude? I've talked to Redpillers with a less ridiculous understanding of feminism.
Edit: Oh, you are one. Fucking shocker.
During your lifetime, you will see the fat acceptance movement go mainstream. Most of the things we make fun of today are real and they are happening.
Go see the Vaginal Monologues, the play that they keep performing in colleges. Pretty mainstream, not controversial. Male/female relationships are depicted as negative and violent. In the play a women rapes another women it is depicted as a joyous positive experience.
The message is "hate men. men are evil" and its a lesbian separatist play. Lesbianism is natural and female sexuality and sex with men is violent and oppressive. That is how it is being depicted by media.
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I get a feeling you spend more time reading about what some people think feminism is, and not time actually reading about feminism.
There is no way lesbian separatists are anything close to mainstream.
Dont believe anything I saw.
Go read feminist literature or go to a Marx Feminists seminar in SF. Go read the books that are published by people leaving NOW.
> There is no way lesbian separatists are anything close to mainstream.
Go look up the presidents of NOW (the largest feminist organization in US). Look up the books they have written and read them.
You should start with The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State, by Friedrich Engels. They believe that marriage originated in rape and private property. They believe marriage treats women as property, is a form of enslavement and that to liberate women, the patriarchal family (one man, one women) needs to be destroyed. They are explicitly pro-polyandry, anti-paternity and believe paternity should be on maternal lines.
That may sound radial, but its not. People are just ignorant of Marx Feminism and they dont read books. Ignorance however, does not stop people from having beliefs.
Feminism is a social movement. It has organizations, it has leaders, it has books. You have to focus of the organizations (What they do), the leaders (what they say), and the books (What they believe).
Feminism does not exist in the abstract. If you read Mein Kampf, Hilter lays out a series of extremely valid problems the German people were facing, that many people would sympathize with. He does not come out and say "I am going to start WWII and gas all the Jews".
He campaigned on a platform of putting women back in to the kitchen. German women had fight a long protracted struggle for the right to work and Hilter comes out and says "I support feminism" and then says that women belong in the Kitchen. In WWII, America put women into factories and Germany put women back in the kitchen and home (until they were no longer able to do so because of labor requirements for war).
People dont understand social movements. Hilter (I am not even trolling) can say "I support women's Liberation" and "Women belong in the kitchen" and liberated women voted for him. The fact that its not consistent does not matter.
Ask yourself
For instance, in California a women killed four of her children. She murdered them and NOW lobbied to have her acquitted and funding her lawyer for the appeal. NOW is lobbying for legal recognition of "Post Partum insanity", which would allow women no jail time if they kill their children. If a man kills his children, he is a murderer and will go to prison for decades. If a women does it, she will soon legally be recognized as a victim of some newly invented hormonal disorder which excuses her from her behavior.
In Canada, feminists lobbied to have the cohabitation law changed. If you cohabit with girlfriend for two years in Canada, she has a legal right to your property and retained earnings acquired during the relationships.
This is real. Another form of activism by feminists involve Title IX and pushing for tighter enforcement of Title IX on campus. This ranges from "mandatory college rape tribunals", "more convictions by college rape tribunals" and redefining drunk sex on campus to "rape".
Under the standards pushed by feminists, schools are now required to defined drunk sex as rape. If a women has consensual sex, but had alcohol, and later regrets it, that is rape. Colleges are required to adapt these Title IX guidelines or they will lose federal funding.
If a college football team makes 100 million a year in revenue. The team is not allowed to spend it. The school is required to have equal funding for both women and men's sports teams under Title IX. So if Men's football spends 15 million and brings in 100 million then the female football team must receive equal funding. Since there is no interest in many female sports (like football), schools have to go out of way to create female teams and meet the requirements.
There are two women for every man in college. College gender ratios are almost 66/33% in US. There is talk now, of schools losing federal funding if they cannot achieve equal gender ratios in Computer Science and Engineering. This would mean that schools have to effectively institute gender quotas for the only two majors where men out number women.
Feminist activism also includes electing judges who run the family court. Judges who are "fair" face protests and pro-feminist judges receive election campaign contributions from feminist organizations. Judges who do not serve the agenda or who come to "wrong" rulings are removed. Fathers do not lobby or care about which judges sit on family courts.
Feminists are also strongly lobbying against default joint custody, even through science shows that it is the best for the children.
Most people do not understand what the positions of feminism are and what causes they are supporting. They think "free birth control", "ending domestic violence", which are toted in media. You have to understand their world view and read their books to understand the movement.