Pediatrician On CNN: Transgender Girls Will Walk Around Bathrooms With Their Genitals Exposed (mediamatters.org)

ainbow

178 ups - 23 downs = 155 votes

109 comments submitted at 17:09:54 on Mar 3, 2013 by mojaka

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -41 Points
  • 21:35:00, 3 March

Well the problem I think first is that you have a "6-year old transgender" child. This should not even be possible because no one is sexually mature at 6 years old. You can't really have any gender at that age, you don't have kids at that age that fully understand the concept of gender, AND you sure as hell don't endorse a life-changing decision from kid that's 6 years old- I mean this is a K-1Gr person we're talking about. I'm sorry, but regardless of that kid's sex and what gender that kid ascribes to in the future, the kid just has some bad parents.

  • [-]
  • pyxlated
  • 23 Points
  • 22:49:41, 3 March

You sound like a complete jackass- and even more so in your other comments on the topic. Just... stop. You're in the best possible situation to educate yourself directly about this stuff, being part of this community, so you really have no excuse to keep blathering hurtful ignorance. Let's take this from the top, shall we?

  • Neurological gender forms over the course of a few crucial stages during fetal development, and can be influenced to a lesser degree during very early childhood. Gender identity is the psychological response to that neurological reality, and is usually pretty firmly in place by the time a child can even speak. We know this thanks to MRI's of the brains of both cisgender and transgender individuals, and the brains of transgender individuals far more closely match their identified gender than their birth sex. It's not a psychological phenomenon, it's a neurological one.

  • While we have seen NO evidence that allowing a child to express themselves has any negative psychological consequences (indeed, we've found that these children later grow into more confident, healthy, and successful adults if they've been provided with support and acceptance) we have very thoroughly documented extremely negative consequences when a child is prohibited from expressing their gender. Transgender children as young as six have even expressed a desire to die under such circumstances. It amounts to a profound rejection of who they are by everyone they depend on for survival.

  • Wearing different clothes and using different pronouns is not life-changing in any kind of irreversible sense. Even hormone-blockers, which are intended to delay puberty until the child is old enough to make informed decisions about their body, are not irreversible. You simply stop taking them, and hormones resume their course without further ado. What it CAN do, however, is transform the child from depressed, dysfunctional and antisocial into happy, functional and social.

Any questions?

  • [-]
  • Fistocracy
  • 10 Points
  • 01:14:39, 4 March

Right, someone remind to grab some popcorn the next time this guy turns up in a trans thread.

  • [-]
  • _jojoMonkey
  • 27 Points
  • 21:49:54, 3 March

You're getting downvoted because you're completely misinformed about gender identity disorder and its affects.

Regardless of whenever you personally feel is an "acceptable" age about somebody knowing their gender or not - you know, an OPINION - gender studies - you know, reports from trained professionals who study these things for a living - have consistently shown that a variety of trans people DO feel feelings of dysphoria well into the early years of child development.

Maybe you should take your head out of your ass and read a bit before coming on here and shouting off about what YOU think is right and wrong, as opposed to what medical science has shown to be the case, not to mention what the entire trans community has long since known.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -20 Points
  • 22:29:42, 3 March

No, I'm getting downvoted because people don't want to have a serious discussion on the issue; they think "Oh, I'll just downvote because I'm self-righteous and don't want to talk about the issue".

Listen, I was a fucking 6 year old once and I barely knew how to fucking write sentences or construct fucking [critical] thought. If you want to try and pitch the idea that someone with that level of intelligence, who is not sexually active, and knows nothing about gender identity should somehow ascribe to a gender just out of the blue, then I think you're full of shit and aren't being realistic.

Transgenderism may indeed be a natural norm, but it needs to at least take place when it's actually fucking possible, which requires [at the very least] knowledge of gender identities and fucking puberty.

  • [-]
  • SquareIsTopOfCool
  • 20 Points
  • 22:48:15, 3 March

>If you want to try and pitch the idea that someone with that level of intelligence, who is not sexually active, and knows nothing about gender identity should somehow ascribe to a gender just out of the blue, then I think you're full of shit and aren't being realistic.

So... A person can't know whether they're a boy or a girl until they're sexually active? You weren't sure about your gender identity until puberty?

I think you should take other users' advice and read some material on the subject before making claims you can't back up.

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 16 Points
  • 23:01:29, 3 March

Apparently asexual people haven't got genders.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 02:39:28, 4 March

Evidently so. Ditto people who are celibate for any reason.

  • [-]
  • tossaby
  • 5 Points
  • 04:03:53, 4 March

It's true, I'm actually transitioning to a sentient cloud.

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 19 Points
  • 22:54:47, 3 March

because you never had to think about your gender, nothing was off for you. for some of us, we know at a very young age. i knew when i was 7.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -21 Points
  • 23:40:36, 3 March

What!? Suddenly you know who I am?

How can the people here be so arrogant as to automatically assume they know one's biography?

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 9 Points
  • 01:11:41, 4 March

so lemme ask you this, when DID you decide to be the gender that you are?

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 02:49:33, 4 March

When they became sexually active - didn't you read their posts? That's how it works, evidently.

  • [-]
  • Fistocracy
  • 7 Points
  • 03:49:25, 4 March

Totally. Much like snails, young people are hermaphrodites. It's not until their first sexual encounter when one of them shoots a love dart into the other that the two partners assume male or female reproductive roles.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 03:53:37, 4 March

That's so cool!

  • [-]
  • Fistocracy
  • 4 Points
  • 04:07:05, 4 March

It's one of nature's miracles!

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 3 Points
  • 02:53:04, 4 March

Today I Learned....

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 3 Points
  • 03:06:00, 4 March

Me too!

  • [-]
  • nekosune
  • 4 Points
  • 03:14:22, 4 March

It looks like they think being trans = hating your genitals.

More Comments - Not Stored
  • [-]
  • pyxlated
  • 17 Points
  • 00:03:32, 4 March

I'm beginning to think you're a troll.

  • [-]
  • Fistocracy
  • 10 Points
  • 01:13:43, 4 March

Judging by his post history he's just not very good at redditting.

Oh and this isn't the first time he's made a complete tit of himself in a thread about trans issues.

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 6 Points
  • 03:35:11, 4 March

giggles

you sed "tit"

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -12 Points
  • 01:44:44, 4 March

Unfortunately my time in this thread putting forth a fairly sound, unbiased perspective has really let some of the peoples' bad sides show. I know my perspective is different as the next persons', and my perspective may be slanted slightly by my owns views of [my] gender and [my] sexuality. But my perspective is and has been by no means radical in the slightest. I support transgender people entirely; and, if there is evidence that a transgender person would benefit from conversion to a transgender+transsexual then I think that would be highly positive thing for that person to do.

I never attacked anyone or went into some psychopathic rant about how trans are detestable or disgusting. All I did was say that a toddler had no place making a self-determination on gender. And that is all it took to be attacked, ridiculed, and called all manner of ugly names. Or at least that's what several here have done.


But, more to the point of the article, restrooms do exist by a basis of physical sex and are a construct of modern society. In either case the person with a penis should use the room designed for persons with penises, respectively. There shouldn't be any reason for refrain, you're not spending time having a conference in the bathroom, you're removing waste and then you're done. Now if there was a omnisex restroom then by all means it would be a better choice and I would recommend using it!

Does this mean we need these omnisex bathrooms all over the place to address the issue, maybe, I know a lot of people would appreciate it. Maybe that's something that's not really feasible in pre-existing places. Maybe, and so there should then be some kind of new public eddiquette for such matters, maybe! Unfortunately no widely known discussion in that regard has taken place. And maybe that's where at least one of the problems in the encounter of the story arises, and I would think where at least some resolution should start.

  • [-]
  • briarme
  • 8 Points
  • 02:02:05, 4 March

You're talking about a medical condition without any knowledge of the causes and then saying "at least I was polite, though" when people tell you why your understanding of the condition is flawed. Being polite doesn't really count for much when your "sound, unbiased perspective" shows a fundamental ignorance of the condition, and you refuse to learn more about it.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 02:44:36, 4 March

> unbiased perspective

No, sib. You're just not recognizing your bias. As drewie said, as a cis person - right? - your gender identity and your assigned gender and your body are basically congruent with each other. Ergo, it's not something you ever would really have been aware of at that age.

Had they been incongruent, that likely would've been different.

You're speaking from a position of ignorance, and while it's okay to be ignorant about something - literally all that means is just that you don't know something yet - it's important to be able to recognize that, rather than repeatedly stating that, no, in fact you do know and everyone else is just wrong.

> restrooms exist by a basis of physical sex

Nope, they're gender-based. You know how you can know? First off, they're generally divided into girls/women and boys/men; they aren't labeled "Penis-havers" and "Vagina-havers". Secondly - when was the last time someone asked to inspect your junk to make sure you were in the right bathroom? Right: never.

> In either case the person with a penis should use the room designed for persons with penises, respectively.

That's nice, except for the part where a lady with a penis is not going to be in for a good time going into the men's room. There are safety concerns. And ditto the reverse: a dude isn't likely to be welcome in the women's room even if he has a vagina.

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 5 Points
  • 04:29:58, 4 March

>my perspective may be slanted slightly by my owns views of [my] gender

Exactly. You haven't been in the situation, so you are claiming no one can be. You claim to understand that you're perspective isn't perfect, yet insist you are correct when told that you are wrong by people who have been in the situation.

>In either case the person with a penis should use the room designed for persons with penises, respectively.

There are no bathrooms designated for penises or bathrooms designated for vaginas. There are bathrooms for men and women.

>There shouldn't be any reason for refrain, you're not spending time having a conference in the bathroom, you're removing waste and then you're done.

Yes, so why not just let people go to the restroom where they feel comfortable, remove their waste, and leave, instead of forcing them to go into a bathroom where they will stand out, be noticed, and possibly ridiculed?

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 6 Points
  • 04:21:58, 4 March

You're saying that people can't feel this way, while being told that many people here have felt exactly that way.

If you're claiming children can't be transgender, then obviously for you "because you never had to think about your gender, nothing was off for you" when you were a child, or you would know that what you're saying isn't true.

  • [-]
  • briarme
  • 8 Points
  • 01:23:16, 4 March

/u/pyxlated responded to you seriously, and you still haven't replied. They already pointed out that the brain differentiates by sex in the uterus and is independent of puberty. Since then you've just been spouting out your ideas without any kind of real support for your view and then whining when people in the trans-friendly sub are downvoting you. Have a review of the scientific literature on the subject, pages 43-44 are the most relevant to this discussion and 48-52 cover transsexuality in general.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -9 Points
  • 02:37:44, 4 March

That's because, ironically, it goes in-line with everything I said, despite his name calling.

His last two points are exactly my views and his first essentially states [from the best I can understand] that the compelling-ness to change physical sex stems from a neurological disorder (which assumingly can be positively treated either with hormone therapy or conversion depending on the individual); which again makes sense. And he goes on to mention the one treatment to postpone puberty or whatever so that the person can make a better assessment of their situation at a time when their more mature, which again, is exactly the kind of thing I've been talking about the entire time.

From my perspective we're all arguing the same thing but I'm being called a jackass. I chose not to respond to that post for that very reason.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 4 Points
  • 03:04:05, 4 March

What the fuck is this "conversion" thing you keep referring to?

Literally the only treatment that's ever been found for the dysphoria caused by having a neurologically-based gender identity that's incongruent with your assigned-at-birth gender and/or your body (which, yes, can manifest at a very early age) is transition. That can include HRT, it can include surgery, and it can (and almost always does) include social transition - living as a member of one's identified gender.

This thread is about a girl with a penis being allowed to live as herself, and while you're talking out one side of your mouth about ostensible support, you're for some reason arguing against that? But also claiming you're in favor of hormone blockers to delay puberty! I think you maybe have some really weird-ass ideas about what transition entails, particularly for minors, and that's why the shit you're saying doesn't really make any sense.

But hey, that's fixable!

These are the current Standards of Care put out by the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (PDF warning). Skip to page 172 (noting that it starts at 165), and be sure to read at least the following sections:

  • Psychological and Social Interventions for Children and Adolescents (175)

  • Social Transition in Early Childhood (176)

  • Physical Interventions for Adolescents (176)

  • Risks of Withholding Medical Treatment for Adolescents (177)

And then, having read the opinions of the experts on the subject, if you feel like it, come back and tell me just why exactly you think you know better than they (and the APA, BTW) do.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -7 Points
  • 03:23:14, 4 March

>What the fuck is this "conversion" thing you keep referring to?

Conversion=Transition

/word choice difference, I meant transition.

>This thread is about a girl with a penis being allowed to live as herself, and while you're talking out one side of your mouth about ostensible support, you're for some reason arguing against that? But also claiming you're in favor of hormone blockers to delay puberty! I think you maybe have some really weird-ass ideas about what transition entails, particularly for minors, and that's why the shit you're saying doesn't really make any sense.

This is because among the various posts some people are referring to simple transgenderism and others are referring to transition and I've been trying to accommodate them respectively, as well as I can discern which point is being discussed.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 7 Points
  • 03:34:46, 4 March

> as well as I can discern which point is being discussed.

No, the problem here is that you don't know what you're talking about but you think you do and you aren't listening.

  • [-]
  • briarme
  • 3 Points
  • 05:15:36, 4 March

> which assumingly can be positively treated either with hormone therapy or conversion depending on the individual

No, conversion therapy does not and has never worked for trans people. Check out /u/Jessthanthree's link in this thread.

As for the rest of the post, no, their points directly contradict your own. You saying otherwise shows a further deep misunderstanding of the condition, did you read any of the links people have been providing for you?

Your main point: > This should not even be possible because no one is sexually mature at 6 years old. You can't really have any gender at that age, you don't have kids at that age that fully understand the concept of gender, AND you sure as hell don't endorse a life-changing decision from kid that's 6 years old- I mean this is a K-1Gr person we're talking about.

My understanding of this, correct me if I'm wrong, is "you can't really know if you need to transition as a child, because you're not intellectually or sexually mature."

/u/pyxlated asserted that

  • Gender identity is established from before birth, because human brains are sex-differentiated: therefore yes, a child can and does have "gender at that age"
  • Nobody is pushing un-alterable surgery on this child yet, and what the child is doing now has been shown to have positive results overall: no "life-changing decision"s are being made right now, and allowing the child to express their sense of gender identity is probably the most healthy option in this situation

None of the above is at all in line with your post.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 5 Points
  • 02:38:56, 4 March

> No, I'm getting downvoted because people don't want to have a serious discussion on the issue; they think "Oh, I'll just downvote because I'm self-righteous and don't want to talk about the issue".

Wrong. I for one have been both downvoting you and responding to you. "Downvote terrible comments" is, however, the Ainbow Standard Model.

> ...who is not sexually active, and knows nothing about gender identity...

These remain completely separate things, despite your treating them as linked.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -8 Points
  • 02:48:52, 4 March

>>...who is not sexually active, and knows nothing about gender identity...

>These remain completely separate things, despite your treating them as linked.

This is the last time I'm gonna say this, and I'll make it as blunt as possible:

You can't [rationally] (for instance) say you wanna be guy but then detest what it's like having a penis function, therefore you need to, logically, understand how sex parts work/what sex parts would be like if you intend to go forward with conversion.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 03:04:40, 4 March

And I'm going to say again, as bluntly as possible: you're absolutely incorrect, and you have no idea what you're talking about.

And I'm sincerely curious as to what authority you think you have on the subject, that should give your (ignorant) opinions on the subject more weight than those of the experts who have spent decades working in this field.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -5 Points
  • 03:13:07, 4 March

So you're saying: a 6yo cisgender female wants to become a male, doesn't know anything about penises, gets a penis, finds out they don't like it, "oh well, you should've read the fine print", has to live with it, but the decision made total sense for a 6yo.

For christ sake I never even got straight answers about vaginas in Sex Ed in Jr. High. But you expect a Kindergardener to be completely informed enough to make a decision about transition.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 8 Points
  • 03:33:10, 4 March

> So you're saying: a 6yo cisgender female

Well the problem I think first is that you have a "6-year old cisgender" child. This should not even be possible because no one is sexually mature at 6 years old. You can't really have any gender at that age, you don't have kids at that age that fully understand the concept of gender, AND you sure as hell don't endorse a life-changing decision from kid that's 6 years old- I mean this is a K-1Gr person we're talking about. I'm sorry, but regardless of that kid's sex and what gender that kid ascribes to in the future, any supposedly-cisgender 6-year-old just has some bad parents.

I mean, right? That's your position, right?

How can a 6-year-old know she doesn't want to be a boy if she's not sexually active? She can't possibly know, right? RIGHT?

Of course the fuck not right.

> So you're saying: a 6yo cisgender female wants to become a male, doesn't know anything about penises, gets a penis, finds out they don't like it, "oh well, you should've read the fine print", has to live with it, but the decision made total sense for a 6yo.

Fuck no, I'm not saying that. It's clear that you didn't read the shit I linked you and you haven't been listening. That's fine, though. Listen up this time, please, because I'm only going to explain this once. You seem to think the process for trans kids works like this:

  • A-assigned-at-birth child says "I'm a B"

  • Parents listen and take the kid seriously

  • Kid begins living as a B

  • Kid is now locked into that forever and must get surgery ASAP regardless of any reconsideration down the line

And let me tell you, wow is that not how it works. Rather, it's likely to go more like this:

  • A-assigned-at-birth child says "I'm a B"

  • (One hopes) parents listen and take the kid seriously

  • Parents most likely take the kid to a therapist, who may diagnose kid with Gender Dysphoria

  • Kid may is (hopefully) given the option to begin living as a B

  • Kid almost certainly continues to see a therapist periodically

  • Kid may realize that kid is actually an A after all and stop living as a B at any time

  • As puberty approaches, kid is given the option to start taking hormone blockers to prevent A-type puberty

  • Kid may realize that kid is actually an A after all and stop living as a B and taking hormone blockers at any time

  • Around 16, kid is given the option to take exogenous hormones (estrogen for trans girls, testosterone for trans boys)

  • Kid may realize that kid is actually an A after all and stop living as a B and taking hormones at any time

  • At some point (probably after reaching majority, or with parental consent I'd imagine no younger than 16 or so), kid may choose to get surgery, including genital surgery - if and when he or she can afford it

It isn't the case that allowing this girl to use the bathroom that matches her fucking gender rather than humiliating her by making her use the boy's room somehow magically entails that she's forced to choose to get surgery at a later date. Hell, she may be really happy with her transition and still never choose to get surgery. That happens.

Maybe if you'd asked questions instead of just making a bunch of assertions based on what you thought you knew, this all could have been avoided.

^(Edit: I accidentally a step.)

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 6 Points
  • 03:45:01, 4 March

>So you're saying: a 6yo cisgender female wants to become a male, doesn't know anything about penises, gets a penis, finds out they don't like it,

and there you go again, talking out of your ass. less than 1% of all trans girls and boys de-transition. look it up, you can because there have been studies done about it. they're called facts. i know they might be inconvenient to your narrative, but oh well, tough shit, you'll just have to change.

even at that age, some of us KNOW if we're supposed to be a boy or a girl, no matter how much people like you insist to the contrary.

i knew i was a girl at 7, even tho everybody else kept telling me i was a boy. i knew i wasnt supposed to have a penis.

so instead of being a stubborn idiot, why dont you listen to what everybody here in this thread has been saying. SOME OF US KNOW.

and the proper treatment for those of us who present with gender dysphoria that young is to go on hormone blockers until we get to 18 to decided to start on hormones. if you'd bothered to do even a cursory lookup on the internet for the protocol for treating gender dysphoric children, you'd know.

but you'd rather just make stuff up as you go along.

wake up and smell the coffee. or at least listen to the people who actually know what they're talking about.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 23 Points
  • 21:45:22, 3 March

Totally. It absolutely is a "life-changing decision" to allow a child to live as a member of the gender they identify as.

PS, you're conflating sexuality and gender identity - they're very, very different things.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -16 Points
  • 22:18:33, 3 March

I'm not "conflating" anything, I said exactly what I meant.

I'm not sure where you're getting your ideas about my post.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 18 Points
  • 22:44:05, 3 March

> [Having a "6-year-old transgender" child] should not even be possible because no one is sexually mature at 6 years old.

Again: sexuality (including sexual maturity) and gender identity are completely separate issues.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -20 Points
  • 23:18:05, 3 March

But they are directly related [if your talking about conversion]. You can't claim to [want] be female gender without knowing how boobs work or how ovaries/vagina work(s), or a male without any understanding of how testicles/a penis work(s).

  • [-]
  • drewiepoodle
  • 9 Points
  • 01:10:54, 4 March

says somebody who doesnt know that sex and gender are two different things and is compounding their ignorance by stating the exact opposite of all the known scientific evidence and published conclusions.

that's good.

and for your next trick, would you care to deny evolution? or maybe gravity. after all, it's only a theory, right?

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 5 Points
  • 01:38:56, 4 March

Yeah, you definitely can. Two major issues. Socially, kids at that age are definitely aware of the difference between boys and girls - again, socially, not physiologically - and gender identity being a person's inborn sense of which of those boxes they fit into (if either), yes, it's absolutely possible for a kid to recognize that (and that's the primary reason that I say you're conflating gender with sexuality). In addition to that, it very much seems to be the case that people's mental maps of their bodies include, you know, their junk, in which case it's certainly reasonable that someone at that age could have a sense of their body being wrong even if they didn't quite know why - although yes, that physical dysphoria AFAIK tends to manifest more strongly around puberty and the development of secondary sex characteristics.

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 20 Points
  • 22:26:04, 3 March

If a cis child called themself a girl or a boy, would you say "No, you're too young to say that!"?

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 16 Points
  • 22:44:45, 3 March

Srsly. 6 years old is too young for a kid to know that they're not trans. I mean amirite or amirite?

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -18 Points
  • 23:29:18, 3 March

I think that's a rather vague, heavily circumstance-based question.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 6 Points
  • 02:36:36, 4 March

I don't think it is, and I'm genuinely curious as to your answer.

Your position seems to be that if a child that was assigned male at birth - a child born with a penis, generally speaking - says "I'm a girl", that child shouldn't be taken seriously until they're older - on the basis that they're not sexually mature and ergo really have no idea what they're talking about.

Would it not also follow that if a male-assigned child said "I'm a boy", that shouldn't be taken seriously, either, for the exact same reasons?

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -2 Points
  • 02:59:57, 4 March

>Your position seems to be that if a child that was assigned male at birth - a child born with a penis, generally speaking - says "I'm a girl", that child shouldn't be taken seriously until they're older - on the basis that they're not sexually mature and ergo really have no idea what they're talking about.

>Would it not also follow that if a male-assigned child said "I'm a boy", that shouldn't be taken seriously, either, for the exact same reasons?

YES! And YES!

A Thousand Tiems!

They're just little kids, and that stuff can be dealt with later as long as there aren't any problems with that; and if immediate problems persist for substantial amount of time that it's clear that there is a problem then that's a situation, then, where treatment would be encouraged and may even be necessary if that's what the proper physician person determines.

  • [-]
  • Jess_than_three
  • 5 Points
  • 03:07:40, 4 March

So you genuinely think that any "boy" who says he's a "boy" shouldn't be taken seriously, and that it should be assumed that "he" is equally as likely to be trans as to be cis?

Weird.

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -3 Points
  • 04:49:52, 4 March

>So you genuinely think that any "boy" who says he's a "boy" shouldn't be taken seriously

Yes to this.

>and that it should be assumed that "he" is equally as likely to be trans as to be cis?

I think? Your question has me confused [in a thoughtful way]. I think the appropriate answer would be that "he" is likely to be "whatever", if that makes any sense?

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 5 Points
  • 03:16:36, 4 March

For some reason I doubt that every time someone, including themself, calls a child by a gender you "correct" them.

Gender has nothing to do with sexuality or maturity. A person can know that their body is wrong without being sexual yet. Or at all; would you claim asexual people can't have genders?

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 3 Points
  • 03:16:30, 4 March

There is as much information to my statement as there is to the article. All we know is the child says she is trans, and you say she isn't, and in my example all we know is the child says they are cis (though probably they don't know that term).

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -6 Points
  • 03:36:13, 4 March

>and you say she isn't

I have never said that anywhere. I have made generalized supposition on the available facts that their is something questionable about the child's status. I don't have any more knowledge of this person's situation than what was in the article. However, the absence of information leaves the story open to reader interpretation.

  • [-]
  • Andraste733
  • 4 Points
  • 04:19:26, 4 March

And this would be?

>"6-year old transgender" child. This should not even be possible

And can you really say that you would have questioned them if they said they were the gender they appear to be?

  • [-]
  • GabbiKat
  • 19 Points
  • 22:33:21, 3 March

I knew at age 5 I fucking HATED with all my soul being born male. So fuck you and what you think.

  • [-]
  • runpmc
  • 15 Points
  • 22:07:14, 3 March

You can't have gender at 6? Why, then, do I see a constant parade of 6 year-old boys in Spider Man clothes and girls in Disney Princess gear? Couldn't be because they've already absorbed social gender characteristics, after all kids of that age have no gender, right? So what could be the cause, I wonder...

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -17 Points
  • 22:15:11, 3 March

Parents ಠ_ಠ.

  • [-]
  • runpmc
  • 14 Points
  • 23:01:21, 3 March

Parents who buy the stuff because their kids want it, because the kids identify with those generally gender-specific icons. Social gender norms are self-evidently present from the moment parents start wondering what to name the baby and what color to paint the nursery. How is this not gettable?

  • [-]
  • orlin002
  • -16 Points
  • 23:07:36, 3 March

But who ultimately buys the stuff the kids want? The parents. If a boy says he wants a dress and the parents say no, then guess what happens? He doesn't get the dress.

How is that not gettable.

  • [-]
  • runpmc
  • 15 Points
  • 23:55:59, 3 March

...and why would the parents refuse to buy their boy a dress? Because they're encouraging gender-specific behavior, not unlike the rest of society. Which, if you were paying attention, was the point I made above. By the age of six, children are already well-steeped in gender norms and have been taught that boys do boy things and girls do girl things, and therefore are capable of knowing whether they are themselves boys or girls.

I have enjoyed this little chat.