User exposed for faking being mute at /r/askreddit (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
602 ups - 159 downs = 443 votes
191 comments submitted at 15:47:59 on Mar 7, 2014 by anjumahmed
User exposed for faking being mute at /r/askreddit (np.reddit.com)
SubredditDrama
602 ups - 159 downs = 443 votes
191 comments submitted at 15:47:59 on Mar 7, 2014 by anjumahmed
I do enjoy the unpopular opinion threads because I can go through it, tag all the racists at the top of the thread and know who to ignore.
They're funny because they get predictable.
You can go into any one of them and inevitably find a "Black people don't tip" comment where someone from every state in the US will proceed to check in.
It's like clockwork.
You forget to add that it devolves into an analysis of the tipping culture in general between America and Australia.
That's the most hilarious part about it too! People take it so god damned far. Analyze it all you want, at the end of the day the server sees:
That's where it stops. They don't care about backstory, they don't care about the person in question's upbringing, they don't care about history or that person's trials and tribulations. They don't think about the deeper meaning.
That's a very optimistic view of how people analyze statistics. More likely confirmation bias.
If I'm a server, and I keep track of every table's tip, and a disproportionately large percentage of black tables don't tip, what am I supposed to say then? Are we supposed to ignore statistics and just live in super-equality-blanket-general fantasy land?
I was a server too, and I'm not disagreeing with you. I just think it's funny how it comes up literally every time.
It's become one of those things that is so common now that even non-servers are well-aware of it, so everyone has to show how aware they are by mentioning it every change they get.
There was even an episode of Louie where he gets mad at some white waitress for being racist by saying black people don't tip and then a black waitress comes out and ridicules him for thinking that black people leave tips.
Once something becomes a TV programme joke everyone has to play the "I've always known that!" card by bringing it up constantly.
No, personal anecdotes have their place, but the mistake is saying "black people don't tip" just because the black people you've encountered didn't.
Plus, there's plenty of room for confirmation bias. What about all of the white people who didn't tip?
We can have a discussion on that too. As long as you make sure to make note of the ones who do tip, you can see the trend. People seem to think that if I treated every single table the same and recorded all their tips, and then at the end of a month the data showed that 90% of the times I got stiffed it was by black people, I'D be the racist.
I agree with what you said about personal anecdotes. They're nice, but the plural of anecdote isn't data.
Question then: at what point would a plethora of anecdotes become data? Is it never, because its not scientifically gathered?
It depends on whether you like the result or not.
If so then "it's a trend" and if not then "anecdotes are not data."
Datum just means "a piece of information". Science doesn't have a monopoly on the word.
Actually yes. We have science for a reason. Left to our own devices we tend to come up with incredibly ridiculous things to believe. Without rigorous systems to weed out bias and other sources of error we are really not that good and getting to the truth.
Look how long it took us to figure out not to shit in the drinking water or all the various superstitious nonsense people believe.
I am not going to trust any amount of anecdotes from people I know are just as biased as I am.
I would say unless these anecdotes are gathered under controlled conditions and properly analyzed, it is indeed never.
Indeed good sir! This is my proper medical opinion!
can't tell if this is an ironic shitpost or just average redditor le sir speak.
Is "Most black people I've served don't tip" acceptable? Because I feel like that's just inviting a "Must be your shitty service, racist" from the impulsive white-guilt peanut gallery.
It's just a shitty way to gather data. If I tell you, "People who look like this never tip" you'll notice every time it happens and you won't notice when they do tip. Your brain will look for the data to confirm a pattern you already believe exists.
See my other response to you, this'll get confusing if we keep bouncing between two different chains.
Yeah, that's alright. The only problem comes when someone takes a personal experience and acts like it's the be-all-end-all of the discussion. That's not even to mention cultural reasons why a black person might tip less (for example, they grew up in poverty and aren't used to going to places with tipping).
That's exactly what I'm trying to say here, I have never said my results would be indicative of the entire population, yet all my comments are being hidden because how dare I even suggest a black person has ever stiffed a waiter.
>white-guilt
groan
>Ignoring an observable blindness
sigh
relevant
I have never said that, and people are trying to tear me a new one here. This is ridiculous.
... because you're more likely to notice when someone doesn't tip when they walk in with a giant "DOES NOT TIP" sign on their face and the internet has told you to watch out for people with those signs because they won't tip.
Umm no. Listen...
>If I'm a server, and I keep track of every table's tip...
I wouldn't be only keeping track of black tables, or letting skin color affect my performance. Every table.
The only thing the internet has taught me is that there are an obscene amount of people out there that let bullshit impede progress. I know you think you're helping, but you're slowing everybody down.
But you're not going to do that. And even if you did keep track of every single table, their skin color, and how much they tip, and you did it for an entire year and found that not one time did a black patron tip, that still would not be enough data. Maybe in your area black people are particularly impoverished. Maybe there's been some real asshole waiters in the past that make them not want to tip. Maybe it's YOUR attitude that keeps you from getting tips.
But the real problem is you and everyone else that declare that black people just don't tip are taking your experiences with individual people and extrapolating them to represent millions of people. That's not science. It's not meaningful in any way. And it tells far more about your own attitude than about black people.
If you did a similar test and the results were that tipping is equal across race, I guarantee that would consider it a legitimate study.
That's how statistics work. If you agree with the conclusion, all right, that study is solid. If not, it's a bad study and needs more work.
Seriously, they've even done research on how editors screen research. That's basically how it works. That and adding nonsense equations to papers to make them seem more "scientific" and legitimate are the two easiest ways to ensure your work will be published.
So sampling isn't valid? If you want to measure something you have to survey every person in the country? There goes the entire field of surveys, social sciences, etc.
The real problem - drawing conclusions is from a large number of observed data points is usually fine. Unless it makes you racist or sexist, in which case its not fine.
Random sampling in an objective environment is a valid way to measure things. The rule of thumb is 10% of the value you are attempting to sample.
However, the above comment wasn't talking about random sampling. He was talking about a specific people (attending the same restaurant) in a specific area (wherever it is located) and a specific waiter (himself). Also, self-reported findings which are notoriously unreliable. These things do not make for good data.
But the problem is that his "finding" is "black people don't tip". What black people? Black Americans? Don't tip at restaurants? Nowhere? What socio-economic class are we talking about? Inner city or suburbs? Or are we talking about black people globally? If we have immigrants from Nigeria, will they refuse to tip?
There's way too many variables to be able to say, with one random person on the internet's findings, that black people everywhere do not tip.
> There's way too many variables to be able to say, with one random person on the internet's findings, that black people everywhere do not tip.
Good thing that isn't what I'm saying at all, genius.
Holy assumptions Batman. I'm not trying to say you could extrapolate the data to the entire population, but you could absolutely use it to establish a trend in your area. Never have I said why they wouldn't either, that's not in question, but you can demonstrate that the trend exists. Being too scared to do so because ignorant people will call you a racist distracts from actually getting to the root of the issue, whatever it may be.
>Being too scared to do so because ignorant people will call you a racist distracts from actually getting to the root of the issue, whatever it may be.
Right... but the "root of the issue" as far as this example goes is, "Fucking cheap niggers won't tip me!"
I delivered pizzas for about a year and I had a friend that worked with me and worked there before I did and swore up and down that black people never tipped or gave horrible tips. But I never had a problem with it. And in fact, among the memories I have of the largest tips I ever received, two of them were black people.
So does my completely anecdotal experience mean that black people tip well? Or can we agree that both are horribly bias and unscientific and probably don't really mean anything. After all, let's not forget that if you treat someone you are serving like you expect them to stiff you, you might find them less inclined to be generous.
I just can't take you seriously any more, way too many assumptions and sensationalism.
nah. he hit you pretty square on.
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In that highly unrealistic scenarios, yes, you might have a point. Just not in reality.
You think keeping track of numbers and analyzing them is highly unrealistic? No wonder you're so backwards.
No, the highly unrealistic scenario that your statistical analysis reveals a large disparity between black tippers and white tippers. I mean, I doubt too many servers keep a spread sheet of their tips categorized by race, but I guess if you are a racist asshole you might.
Or maybe I'm interested in actually getting to the root of the issue. Seriously, nothing is ever going to get better for anyone because people like you are going to drown out meaningful voices with your garbage.
I'm sorry, am I drowning out your meaningful message that black people aren't good tippers? How will society ever progress without your valuable contribution...
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"statistics"
Remember, feels > reals!
> They're funny because they get predictable.
Always something about eugenics.
Followed by the standard shitstorm of "tipping is bullshit" and "servers work hard" and "they should be paid properly" and "you should be happy with whatever I give you you ungrateful scum" and so on and so forth. I don't think we're allowed to mention tipping without the associated drama.
I thought reddit hated tips, but I guess they hate black people more?
Eugenics. Every single time. I hate those threads because if you actually have a real unpopular opinion you get downvoted shit like I have before.