$2900 Later I Got My First Bike (imgur.com)

{motorcycles}

38 ups - 17 downs = 21 votes

63 comments submitted at 04:11:38 on Sep 6, 2013 by reubadoob

  • [-]
  • ZombieHoratioAlger
  • 4 Points
  • 04:22:11, 6 September

I'll be the one to say it...a 110 horsepower sportbike isn't exactly an ideal first motorcycle.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -15 Points
  • 04:41:43, 6 September

Can't say didn't expected the comment.

I'm a Libertarian which means I don't know what's best/ideal for everyone else i.e what consistutes as "an ideal first motorcylce". I just know what is best for myself.

  • [-]
  • Gundamnitpete
  • 13 Points
  • 08:38:52, 6 September

I'm not saying you shouldn't get a ZZR-600 as a first bike.

But this is the dumbest bag of shit I've ever heard. Seriously what the fuck does politics have to do with a sportbike?

The bike was made for an experienced rider. You aren't.

  • [-]
  • kekspernikai
  • 6 Points
  • 11:11:48, 6 September

It sounds like someone who just discovered Libertarianism and thinks it fits right in with their worldview that "I do what I want!" Fucking hate politics brought into something like motorcycles.

  • [-]
  • ZombieHoratioAlger
  • 1 Points
  • 14:46:50, 6 September

"Custom exhaust", chrome farkles, $2800. It's loud, shiny, and cheap.

Apparently, libertarianism means all other concerns should be ignored because it's the bike for him, even though it has somewhere between twice and quadruple the power of most learner bikes and a brutal throttle response.

I hope OP finds another ride soon. This thing is going to hurt somebody.

  • [-]
  • burnafterreading91
  • 1 Points
  • 15:21:07, 6 September

You wouldn't understand, you're not a librarian like I am.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -6 Points
  • 10:35:43, 6 September

It has very little to do with politics and everything to do with being able to make your own decisions as to what is best for the individual. In this case me. The beauty of the country is the ability for everyone to make decisions even ones that you consider, "the dumbest bag of shit ".

  • [-]
  • asgeorge
  • 1 Points
  • 15:30:08, 6 September

Hey Man, don't worry about all this. Focus on getting yourself into a MSF Rider training course, getting some solid safety equipment (helmet, jacket, leather gloves, kevlar jeans, over the ankle boots) and take the time to go to an empty commuter lot on the weekend to practice slow speed maneuvers (U-turns (tight U-Turns), taking off from full left/right steering lock; slow speed, straight ahead creeping (like rush hour will be like)). Also, practice hard, HARD braking (they teach you that at the MSF). You WILL need that skill at least once in your life.

And please, always, ATGATT. Even on hot days, when you are going 1 mile to the grocery store, all the gear.... You will never drop your bike and wish you were wearing less gear.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • 1 Points
  • 16:11:00, 6 September

Thanks for the positive encouragement. I have taken the MSF course and plan to practice minimum of 1 hour/day in an empty lot. To include re-reading the MSF book & watching the videos if I can find them online.

ATGATT goes without saying. I owe it to my family.

Again I can't say thank you enough for positive encouragement to ride & practice.

  • [-]
  • elos_
  • 13 Points
  • 05:15:01, 6 September

I don't think that's quite what libertarianism means.

Ride what you want, but just know this isn't a forgiving bike. This is a bike intended for people who already have skillsets developed. You aren't going to automatically die or automatically be a bad rider but you should err on the side of caution -- moreso than a newbie rider usually would. 110 horsepower is a lot of fucking horsepower and these bikes are not exactly graceful if you don't know what you're doing.

I don't know how you can say you know what's best for yourself if this is your first motorcycle though.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -8 Points
  • 11:02:53, 6 September

> I don't think that's quite what libertarianism means.

> I don't know how you can say you know what's best for yourself if this is your first motorcycle though.

I'm not sure you understand the concept of the individual knowing what is best for herself or himself above all others, and if that is the case this is really going to go now where. Want to learn more about on the primacy of individual liberty, political freedom, and voluntary association? I would encourage you to visit /r/Libertarian. It's a great community and I'm not being sarcastic. I encourage all to check it out.

But if you would like to criticize my purchase some more on whatever grounds that's fine too. It's a free country for the most part.

  • [-]
  • aminal
  • 4 Points
  • 13:16:02, 6 September

Knowing what's best for oneself is not the same thing as ignoring advice and evidence. You can certainly decide for yourself what you think is best, and nobody can tell you otherwise. But, just because you think something is best for you does not mean that it actually is best. Being libertarian, you can still use forethought and take the advice of others. This doesn't go against your philosophy.

It very well may be a good first bike for you. But, don't mistake freedom of choice for freedom from prudence.

Be safe.

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:07:37, 6 September

> But, just because you think something is best for you does not mean that it actually is best.

This is just a play on words. What you're actually saying here is "Just because you think you know what's best doesn't mean you are right. Somebody else probably knows what's best for you better than you do." Which is quite a ballsy arrogant comment to make. How the hell do you know what he can handle and what is best for him? I started on a supersport and it was perfect for me. It just depends what kind of person you are.

Nobody knows better than themselves what they can handle and what is good for them. Nobody. Any opinion to the contrary is just you projecting what you think is good for you onto other people. A lot like telling somebody they can't have an abortion because you don't agree with them. You can have an opinion on the matter, and nobody will stop you, but that doesn't make you correct, most especially when it's concerning somebody else, and not you.

  • [-]
  • aminal
  • 1 Points
  • 14:20:18, 6 September

>Somebody else probably knows what's best for you better than you do.

I would replace "probably" with "might". And that would be an accurate statement about how I feel.

>Nobody knows better than themselves what they can handle and what is good for them.

This is just plain wrong. By this logic, no parent should ever attempt to stop their children from doing anything, no matter how ill advised or dangerous.

Why do we have doctors? Or engineers? Or teachers? Why do we have anyone in any position ever that we ask for advice, or lessons, or help? Because one can not know all things, an one is not always in the best position to decide what it right or wrong.

Now, I'm not saying you are wrong here. Like I said earlier, you might be right. I don't know you. But, like you said:

>You can have an opinion on the matter, and nobody will stop you, but that doesn't make you correct

This applies to you as well. You can have an opinion, and nobody will stop you, but that doesn't make you correct. No matter how much you believe it.

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:30:48, 6 September

So what makes it different? How is it that you can know about yourself well enough to determine how other people think because that's how you think, but when it comes down to somebody else, there's just no way they can be as wise as you on the topic? That's absurd.

Doctors and engineers are poor analogies. We're not talking about somebody else who is an expert in a particular system. We're talking about knowing ones' self. A doctor doesn't know you better than you do. A teacher doesn't know you better than you. A teacher might know some particular pieces of arbitrary knowledge better than you, but that has no relevance to how you actually are.

I didn't say that everybody knows everything. I specifically didn't use those words. I said that people know themselves better than anybody else knows them. Let's take your own example and talk to a doctor. I guarantee he'll agree that he doesn't know your body as well as you do, he just gives very very general advice and hopes it applies. But that doesn't necessarily mean it does. Same here. All he can do is tell you what he's found in his experience and leave it up to you to determine if his experiences are relevant to you. There's nothing saying they are, there's nothing saying they aren't. It's up to you to determine, because he can't get inside your mind to do the determination for you.

> This applies to you as well. You can have an opinion, and nobody will stop you, but that doesn't make you correct.

The difference is, I'm not giving an opinion. I'm just telling you how people work. It is truly impossible to know a person better than they know themselves. How do you think you're going to know a person better than they know themselves? Even if you spent years getting to know this person, you still never know. Otherwise, why would marriages ever end? At a 50% rate? Clearly it's a very common misconception that people have that they think they know somebody else, but really they're just projecting their OWN experiences onto them. And that's somebody who has been in a relationship with somebody for years, how can you be so sure you know this guy after just a couple of comments on reddit? That's ludicrous.

  • [-]
  • aminal
  • 1 Points
  • 14:44:45, 6 September

You're right that knowing oneself is something only the individual can truly know. I'm not disagreeing with you here.

Where I feel your wrong, and is why I chose my doctors and teachers analogy, is because we're talking about purchasing a motorcycle. Knowing what motorcycle is best for you is something that comes with experience. You thinking a particular motorcycle is best for you is not knowing yourself. It is thinking you know what is best for you. There is a difference there.

The doctor analogy comes in like so: Say you get very sick, lets say you catch pneumonia. You have never had pneumonia before. So, you go to the doctor. Now, you feel, because you know yourself very well, that you won't need medication. Your doctor disagrees, and says you need to spend a night or two under supervision and need to be heavily medicated or it's likely you will die.

What do you do? You know yourself so well, surely you must be right! Because, the doctor isn't you, after all. He can't know better that you know what is best for you. Right?

Even if by some miracle you could have survived without medication or bed rest, it would still have been an unwise decision to blow off the doctor because "you know yourself best". Obviously, that is an asinine position to take. And, I don't think that's the way you feel. But what you're not doing is extending that to buying a motorcycle. There are very good reasons why there are bikes suitable for beginners, and bikes that aren't. You might ride your bike for the rest of your life, and be just fine. But that doesn't necessarily mean you made the right choice given the information you had.

And once again, you might be right. I don't know you. I don't know your skill. I don't know your attitude. But you are wrong that someone else can never know what's good for you in any circumstance.

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:53:16, 6 September

> Knowing what motorcycle is best for you is something that comes with experience

This is where we disagree, and why I think your doctor analogy is poor. Obviously I agree with what you said, I'm just saying that it's not analogous to this circumstance. We're not talking about a guy who is about to go ride a bike with no brakes and we're telling him "dude! you're going to die if you do this!" and he's saying "I know myself better than you do!" That might make your analogy make sense.

Experience dictates how you'll behave on the bike, but lack of experience on any bike can end in catastrophe. This is true of everything from a 50cc to a busa. The question comes down to whether or not you have the maturity to recognize the bike's limits, and ride appropriately. It's solely a question of maturity, nothing else. And in that regard, you will never know better than he does.

As I said, I started on a supersport. I knew exactly what I was getting into when I got it. I had the maturity to recognize that I can't just push this thing because it can do it. So I spent the following year pushing it only slightly more each time, progressing from simple stops in parking lots to emergency braking and emergency maneuvering. Taking the MSF class played a big part in teaching me these ideas before I ever got on the bike, and it helped me learn the basics that I needed to know before getting on. After I took the class, I knew that I wasn't an expert, but I knew at the very least that the bike wasn't going to kill me just because it was a supersport. I knew that I could just as easily die on a little ninja. I knew that if I died, it would be because of my actions, not an arbitrary number of engine cc's. And in that respect, there is nobody else on the planet more qualified to make a judgement call than I am.

This is kind of exactly my point, though. You have your experiences, and I have mine. The only difference is, I'm not asserting my opinions as valid on anybody else.

  • [-]
  • TheNoxx
  • 6 Points
  • 08:04:57, 6 September

I bought this exact model bike about 3 weeks ago; I've been riding two wheels my whole life and exclusively motorcycles for commuting to work for 2.5 years now.

I don't know how much time you've logged on this bike or any bike of any kind, as you say elsewhere that it's being worked on, but let me tell you this:

This bike is really, really fast. I'm not going to even comment on your political interpretation of life choices and whatnot, because right now, you need to listen to me. This bike was a little much for me to handle for the first few days; it accelerates like a liter bike (1000+cc) because of how it's designed and how light it is. I've gone from 0-60 in about 2 seconds on this bike. You're going to be able to get yourself into trouble that you might not be able to walk away from, maybe never walk away from ever again, in even less time. Two seconds.

You need to take the MSF 2-day course, and you need to get frame sliders to protect your bike, because if this is going to be your first bike, you are very likely going to lay it down. Wear gear, wear it all the time; an acquaintance of mine that started riding recently on a bike of similar power thought he had it down after taking the MSF course and getting his endorsement, so he went down on the highway at 80 MPH with sneakers and is now without most of 4 of his toes.

Good luck.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • 1 Points
  • 10:43:35, 6 September

> You need to take the MSF 2-day course, and you need to get frame sliders to protect your bike, because if this is going to be your first bike, you are very likely going to lay it down.

Done and done. Because I saved so much on the bike I went with high quality gear.

  • [-]
  • she_did_what
  • 6 Points
  • 10:01:28, 6 September

That's not a good first bike for anyone. Note that we're not infringing your ability to pursue poor decisions though - your political preferences have not been offended; but of course, being libertarian, you were going to let him say whatever he wants right ?

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -1 Points
  • 10:33:41, 6 September

Absolutely

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:10:35, 6 September

It was a great first bike for me, shrug

  • [-]
  • burnafterreading91
  • 1 Points
  • 15:24:04, 6 September

You did not just do that. Ohmygawwwwd.

Start on a 600, if not, THE GOVERNMENT OWNS YOU! 'MERIKUH!

How could you possibly know what's best for you, as a rider with NO experience?

anticipates inevitable "dumped/crashed my bike lol" post

  • [-]
  • Rockran
  • 1 Points
  • 09:58:11, 6 September

If it's your first, how would you know?

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -4 Points
  • 10:52:09, 6 September

I know myself better than anyone on reddit surprisingly. For some reason it seems to be a foreign concept to most. As if because I didn't consult The Internet/Reddit gods before my purchase and start with a smaller bike I am doomed to failure. But really it just comes down to some people think they know what's best for everyone and some of us disagree. Because when it really comes down to it who should be making the decisions in your life? You or someone else?

  • [-]
  • Rockran
  • 5 Points
  • 10:58:32, 6 September

Your line of reasoning is dumb, you can't possibly know what's best for you if you've never tried it.

You're being bitch slapped not because you bought a relatively powerful bike but because your attitude sucks.

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:12:22, 6 September

And you can't possibly know what's best for him until you've been him.

  • [-]
  • Rockran
  • 1 Points
  • 14:14:18, 6 September

ok

  • [-]
  • DocBrownMusic
  • 1 Points
  • 14:17:09, 6 September

Do you need to tell yourself not to be upset often? In response to others? I don't understand.

  • [-]
  • Rockran
  • 1 Points
  • 14:23:29, 6 September

ok

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -2 Points
  • 11:12:27, 6 September

Thanks.

  • [-]
  • AusBox
  • 2 Points
  • 12:39:14, 6 September

Yep, go through life without listening to any advice from anyone.

  • [-]
  • reubadoob
  • -2 Points
  • 13:18:45, 6 September

Especially those from a different country over the internet.

/sarcasm

  • [-]
  • rich_ard
  • 1 Points
  • 13:59:19, 6 September

You don't have much of a line on sarcasm either